Mr/Ms Moderator,
PLEASE, if you are anywhere around here, to take a look at the below (above) junk—
“Anyway, glad to see you back on these boards spewing your vitriol. Did it bring joy to heart to learn that over the weekend the Klan was back at it in Durham and Chi-Town?
They’re making their case for state’s rights and the unfairness of Lincoln’s instigation of the civil war.” - Laslo Toth.
KKK supporters on these boards! This site really DOES need a constant moderator!!!!
(Boring as I find certain sites that DO have one!)
But - really. It is possible to go TOO far, on a progressive blog!
Posted by Liz on Jun 19, 2005 at 10:38 PM
Ah, yes, Jack… The “Khazar” myth, a nice big fat red herring that even had me going for a while… Believed by a lot of the more right-leaning “New Agers”, apparently, as well as by self-hating Jews - and then immediately latched on to by all the REAL anti-semites out there!
Koestler certainly wasn’t doing his race a favor with that twaddle.
But apparently it’s a fable that’s been out there for decades - H. G. Wells mentioned it in his world histories, I believe.
Well, months and months ago, I spent quite a time trawling (not trolling!) the internet for INFORMATION about this from all sources; and it would seem that recent genetic tests do NOT confirm it: most Jews do in fact have Jewish genes, similar to Jews and other sects who have been in Palestine for millennia.
Would give you the website ref if I could be bothered!
The Khazar thing is just another half-truth. I’ve read conflicting accounts of that, as well.
Anyway, when there is a Diaspora, “races” are BOUND to get mixed… An analogy I use is with the modern Greeks. Most of THEM have Turkish blood, as well, and the Turks have had a great influence on their more recent culture. (That guy who wrote “Captain Corelli’s Mandolin” informed me of this.)
Does that make THEM any less “Greek” than the ancients?
Go and tell them that then, and see what you get.
Posted by Liz on Jun 19, 2005 at 10:55 PM
No, Steve!
(They were (the Biblical Jews) probably (natural magic) sorcerors who understood advanced Teslaist vibrations theories; hence they were able to make the walls of Jericho fall with repeated sound waves, which - when they found the right note/interference patterns, caused an earthquake.)
Sorry, Margaret!
But it’s possible to make theory upon theory to explain all these things… From any perspective!
(By the way, I believe Tesla’s vibration theories to be true, though I don’t explain them very well; I can’t now remember his specific technical term. But it’s probably been known about for quite a while…)
THESE days, now, they just smash big bunker-busting bombs along the Earth’s faultlines; and then they wonder when there are huge earthquakes in land zones and sea zones up to a year later, which even threaten America’s West Coast…
Posted by Liz on Jun 19, 2005 at 11:05 PM
Resonance, that’s the word….
Posted by Liz on Jun 19, 2005 at 11:05 PM
Why are Christians supposed to be born-again these days, anyway?
They never taught that when I was at school, in my country…
Surely it is just a US idea?
Posted by Liz on Jun 19, 2005 at 11:07 PM
...“Steve, if you mean that we as humans do not
have an essence, a specific nature, I couldn’t
disagree more. Human agency, like everything else
in nature, is limited and it cannot transcend our
basic essential nature. That stuff about being
a poet in the am, a hunter in the pm, a Goethe
in the evening, is pernicious nonsense because
some choices rule out others”.
Hmm, Jack. The CAVE-MAN (and woman), or indeed the dweller in many early civilizations, eg the herders of the Bible, would NOT have agreed with you there! HE (she) could be a poet in the am (composing songs based on tribal legends), a hunter in the pm (when he saw the tasty game run by), and a Goethe in the evening… (Composing his shamanic musical complete with animal-skin-clad floorshow…) Back to the poet again!!
I suppose there IS something to all this Rousseau stuff…
Still, it’s what I’ve been saying and feeling all along. The last stage of human civilization will resemble the first. Only better. Oh yes…
Posted by Liz on Jun 19, 2005 at 11:20 PM
And, OH yes, I AM a BIG fan of the novelist Jean M. Auel… I love any books like that, too. “Wolf Brother” is another I read recently, which is however more for older children, because its main characters are teens. Great story.
I love books set in prehistory. I might just write my own after a bit of research!
I know I’d have had HONOR in a society like Auel describes! (Many women would - and did.) As for a one with my capability - well. I’d have been the shamaness! I’d have been the herbalist! (Just like the older one in the book - and she sings, too, and so do I!) People would be listening to ME and my ilk, and Jack would definitely be banished to a cave all on his own.
I wouldn’t be pushed onto the sidelines by useless MEN all the time; as I have been for years; there would be no male “bosses” to limit my creativity and that of others in the “workplace” - or whatever passed for it then; there wouldn’t be an exclusive male government… There WOULDN’T be any Neocons… No libertarians… NONE of these dreadful people…
(Oh, and none of these skinny fvcking pop stars, either, to dictate to women and push back those of them that don’t meet the leggy “ideal”, because the “anorexic” model was definitely NOT the peak of human attractiveness, back then…)
Yeah, it would be worth forgoing a few modern comforts for a real sense of community like that… Which REALLY values ALL its members - because they’re ALL scarce, they were then… NO such thing as “unwanted children”...
NO unwanted people, who have to be shuffled off into penitentiaries, because their only hope is to do things which are illegal!
No “races” - per se. No laws, only customs and taboos. No cops! No pigs… Heaven. On Earth.
No religions that aren’t TOTALLY intuitive…
Pity we can’t GET that any more, through primitivism, because there are too many people on earth (to “go back to nature”) and the environment is half-shot.
The only hope, therefore, is socialism!
Posted by Liz on Jun 19, 2005 at 11:37 PM
The fact that some choices rule out others has nothing to do with whether or not there exists an essential nature to human beings. Marx’s quip about a poet in the AM, a hunter in the afternoon, and Noam Chomsky at night also has nother to do with the human nature argument. It was a quote from the Economic and Philosophic Manuscripts of 1844, whereby he was merely recounting the kinds of human possiblities that exist for society once the struggle for subsistence under capitalism has been relegated to the dust bin as well as the idea that the strict specialization and division of labor that takes place under capitalism as a result of the deepening integration of society and concentration and centralization of the forces of production will no longer have any role to play in the society. Hence freedom will be expressed in part by people always exploring a multiplicity of endeavors and vocations.
Posted by steve on Jun 20, 2005 at 6:19 AM
I only do linear logic and at present
only read english, Liz.
So you’ll have to translate into english
if you want a respond.
Koestler debunked the myth of A Jewish
race, precisely the point of his work.
Posted by Jack Barnes on Jun 20, 2005 at 9:07 AM
Steve, the division of labor has been
the greatest boon in the history of
mankind and is not going to be abolished.
The growing capitalism in China will abolish
the CCP instead.
The real alienation existed before capitalism
in the horrors of status society feudalism.
Posted by Jack Barnes on Jun 20, 2005 at 9:11 AM
Jack,
The division of labor has developed the productive forces but also created great poverty and unemployment. The Chinese industrial revolution will only strengthen the CCP but only as an elitist party catering to a new class aloof from the workers needs (who live and work in appalling conditions)who are developing capitalist consumption habits and non-democratic attitudes with regard to popular input into the political system! True the globalization has lifted millions out of poverty. It is high time that more and more working members of society got the fruits of their labor. The Chinese economy is becoming highly concentrated like many capitalist economies and the distribution of wealth there is horrible! This is because foreign TNCs dominate the productive activities and although they reinvest and strengthen China’s national position in the world, there is little raise in the average standard of living for many workers.
Posted by steve on Jun 20, 2005 at 10:53 AM
Capitalism has never created poverty
or unemployment, all unemployment is
the result of govt policies such as the
minimum wage, unions which are a govt
creation and various govt laws & regulations
that harm business.
Half a billion or more Chinese have seen
their standard of living raised considerably
since 1980.
See The Coming Collapse of China by Chang
(spacing on his first name).
It won’t strenghthen the CCP because the
contradictions are becoming too apparent.
Labor does not create wealth in and of itself.
You need to read Human Action by Ludwig
Von Mises.
Posted by Jack Barnes on Jun 20, 2005 at 11:31 AM
Yeah, but “Jack”... Apparently, APPARENTLY, modern genetic testing appears to back up this “consistent Jewish line” idea….
More than Koestler’s ramblings did… Now he could be really non-linear!!
Race is a very amorphous concept though anyway. Of course.
I know you wear glasses, Jack… I know you find it difficult to read the teeny writing on this site - hence, you probably have a really efficient page magnifier, which is one of the reasons you compose your posts in the format you do.
That’s why you don’t like long and complex posts! We know, we know!
Posted by Liz on Jun 20, 2005 at 5:38 PM
Never wore glasses. No problem seeing,
just COMPREHENDING the schizoid wordsalads
that you post.
Koestler was never nonlinear as you would know
if you read The Act of Creation and The Ghost
in the Machine.
Yes, race is a real concept, nothing amorphous
about it.
Posted by Jack Barnes on Jun 21, 2005 at 8:31 AM
Funny, “Liz” or Lez, that the post on black
men has been inoperative today.
Did you do twenty of your crazy long rants
yesterday and cause the system to crash ?
You are a piece of work.
Posted by Jack Barnes on Jun 21, 2005 at 2:24 PM
As always, Jack Barnes is the eternal arschloch.
Posted by Margaret on Jul 8, 2005 at 9:04 AM
Who are you, Margaret ? I’ve seen
your postings under liz, lefty, wwoods,
matthewkkk, douchebagger, steve and unluminous
unbeauty among others….....
Christalmighty, how many monikers you got ?
Posted by Martin on Jul 8, 2005 at 11:07 AM
You said it right, Margaret!
Will he be able to come back and post again, under “Jack Barnes” or any of his other multiples… now that the webmaster has changed the requirements for posting, ie you have to sign on properly? Less opportunity for hundreds of multiples. Sysadmin might have banned “Jack” for that already… he sounded upset about something like that in one of his e-mails to me.
I wonder if we have seen the last of “Jack”??
Posted by Liz on Aug 25, 2005 at 12:23 PM
SAVE 53% OFFTHE NEWSSTAND PRICE!
Reader Comments
Mr/Ms Moderator,
PLEASE, if you are anywhere around here, to take a look at the below (above) junk—
“Anyway, glad to see you back on these boards spewing your vitriol. Did it bring joy to heart to learn that over the weekend the Klan was back at it in Durham and Chi-Town?
They’re making their case for state’s rights and the unfairness of Lincoln’s instigation of the civil war.” - Laslo Toth.
KKK supporters on these boards! This site really DOES need a constant moderator!!!!
(Boring as I find certain sites that DO have one!)
But - really. It is possible to go TOO far, on a progressive blog!
Ah, yes, Jack… The “Khazar” myth, a nice big fat red herring that even had me going for a while… Believed by a lot of the more right-leaning “New Agers”, apparently, as well as by self-hating Jews - and then immediately latched on to by all the REAL anti-semites out there!
Koestler certainly wasn’t doing his race a favor with that twaddle.
But apparently it’s a fable that’s been out there for decades - H. G. Wells mentioned it in his world histories, I believe.
Well, months and months ago, I spent quite a time trawling (not trolling!) the internet for INFORMATION about this from all sources; and it would seem that recent genetic tests do NOT confirm it: most Jews do in fact have Jewish genes, similar to Jews and other sects who have been in Palestine for millennia.
Would give you the website ref if I could be bothered!
The Khazar thing is just another half-truth. I’ve read conflicting accounts of that, as well.
Anyway, when there is a Diaspora, “races” are BOUND to get mixed… An analogy I use is with the modern Greeks. Most of THEM have Turkish blood, as well, and the Turks have had a great influence on their more recent culture. (That guy who wrote “Captain Corelli’s Mandolin” informed me of this.)
Does that make THEM any less “Greek” than the ancients?
Go and tell them that then, and see what you get.
No, Steve!
(They were (the Biblical Jews) probably (natural magic) sorcerors who understood advanced Teslaist vibrations theories; hence they were able to make the walls of Jericho fall with repeated sound waves, which - when they found the right note/interference patterns, caused an earthquake.)
Sorry, Margaret!
But it’s possible to make theory upon theory to explain all these things… From any perspective!
(By the way, I believe Tesla’s vibration theories to be true, though I don’t explain them very well; I can’t now remember his specific technical term. But it’s probably been known about for quite a while…)
THESE days, now, they just smash big bunker-busting bombs along the Earth’s faultlines; and then they wonder when there are huge earthquakes in land zones and sea zones up to a year later, which even threaten America’s West Coast…
Resonance, that’s the word….
Why are Christians supposed to be born-again these days, anyway?
They never taught that when I was at school, in my country…
Surely it is just a US idea?
...“Steve, if you mean that we as humans do not
have an essence, a specific nature, I couldn’t
disagree more. Human agency, like everything else
in nature, is limited and it cannot transcend our
basic essential nature. That stuff about being
a poet in the am, a hunter in the pm, a Goethe
in the evening, is pernicious nonsense because
some choices rule out others”.
Hmm, Jack. The CAVE-MAN (and woman), or indeed the dweller in many early civilizations, eg the herders of the Bible, would NOT have agreed with you there! HE (she) could be a poet in the am (composing songs based on tribal legends), a hunter in the pm (when he saw the tasty game run by), and a Goethe in the evening… (Composing his shamanic musical complete with animal-skin-clad floorshow…) Back to the poet again!!
I suppose there IS something to all this Rousseau stuff…
Still, it’s what I’ve been saying and feeling all along. The last stage of human civilization will resemble the first. Only better. Oh yes…
And, OH yes, I AM a BIG fan of the novelist Jean M. Auel… I love any books like that, too. “Wolf Brother” is another I read recently, which is however more for older children, because its main characters are teens. Great story.
I love books set in prehistory. I might just write my own after a bit of research!
I know I’d have had HONOR in a society like Auel describes! (Many women would - and did.) As for a one with my capability - well. I’d have been the shamaness! I’d have been the herbalist! (Just like the older one in the book - and she sings, too, and so do I!) People would be listening to ME and my ilk, and Jack would definitely be banished to a cave all on his own.
I wouldn’t be pushed onto the sidelines by useless MEN all the time; as I have been for years; there would be no male “bosses” to limit my creativity and that of others in the “workplace” - or whatever passed for it then; there wouldn’t be an exclusive male government… There WOULDN’T be any Neocons… No libertarians… NONE of these dreadful people…
(Oh, and none of these skinny fvcking pop stars, either, to dictate to women and push back those of them that don’t meet the leggy “ideal”, because the “anorexic” model was definitely NOT the peak of human attractiveness, back then…)
Yeah, it would be worth forgoing a few modern comforts for a real sense of community like that… Which REALLY values ALL its members - because they’re ALL scarce, they were then… NO such thing as “unwanted children”...
NO unwanted people, who have to be shuffled off into penitentiaries, because their only hope is to do things which are illegal!
No “races” - per se. No laws, only customs and taboos. No cops! No pigs… Heaven. On Earth.
No religions that aren’t TOTALLY intuitive…
Pity we can’t GET that any more, through primitivism, because there are too many people on earth (to “go back to nature”) and the environment is half-shot.
The only hope, therefore, is socialism!
The fact that some choices rule out others has nothing to do with whether or not there exists an essential nature to human beings. Marx’s quip about a poet in the AM, a hunter in the afternoon, and Noam Chomsky at night also has nother to do with the human nature argument. It was a quote from the Economic and Philosophic Manuscripts of 1844, whereby he was merely recounting the kinds of human possiblities that exist for society once the struggle for subsistence under capitalism has been relegated to the dust bin as well as the idea that the strict specialization and division of labor that takes place under capitalism as a result of the deepening integration of society and concentration and centralization of the forces of production will no longer have any role to play in the society. Hence freedom will be expressed in part by people always exploring a multiplicity of endeavors and vocations.
I only do linear logic and at present
only read english, Liz.
So you’ll have to translate into english
if you want a respond.
Koestler debunked the myth of A Jewish
race, precisely the point of his work.
Steve, the division of labor has been
the greatest boon in the history of
mankind and is not going to be abolished.
The growing capitalism in China will abolish
the CCP instead.
The real alienation existed before capitalism
in the horrors of status society feudalism.
Jack,
The division of labor has developed the productive forces but also created great poverty and unemployment. The Chinese industrial revolution will only strengthen the CCP but only as an elitist party catering to a new class aloof from the workers needs (who live and work in appalling conditions)who are developing capitalist consumption habits and non-democratic attitudes with regard to popular input into the political system! True the globalization has lifted millions out of poverty. It is high time that more and more working members of society got the fruits of their labor. The Chinese economy is becoming highly concentrated like many capitalist economies and the distribution of wealth there is horrible! This is because foreign TNCs dominate the productive activities and although they reinvest and strengthen China’s national position in the world, there is little raise in the average standard of living for many workers.
Capitalism has never created poverty
or unemployment, all unemployment is
the result of govt policies such as the
minimum wage, unions which are a govt
creation and various govt laws & regulations
that harm business.
Half a billion or more Chinese have seen
their standard of living raised considerably
since 1980.
See The Coming Collapse of China by Chang
(spacing on his first name).
It won’t strenghthen the CCP because the
contradictions are becoming too apparent.
Labor does not create wealth in and of itself.
You need to read Human Action by Ludwig
Von Mises.
Yeah, but “Jack”... Apparently, APPARENTLY, modern genetic testing appears to back up this “consistent Jewish line” idea….
More than Koestler’s ramblings did… Now he could be really non-linear!!
Race is a very amorphous concept though anyway. Of course.
I know you wear glasses, Jack… I know you find it difficult to read the teeny writing on this site - hence, you probably have a really efficient page magnifier, which is one of the reasons you compose your posts in the format you do.
That’s why you don’t like long and complex posts! We know, we know!
Never wore glasses. No problem seeing,
just COMPREHENDING the schizoid wordsalads
that you post.
Koestler was never nonlinear as you would know
if you read The Act of Creation and The Ghost
in the Machine.
Yes, race is a real concept, nothing amorphous
about it.
Funny, “Liz” or Lez, that the post on black
men has been inoperative today.
Did you do twenty of your crazy long rants
yesterday and cause the system to crash ?
You are a piece of work.
As always, Jack Barnes is the eternal arschloch.
Who are you, Margaret ? I’ve seen
your postings under liz, lefty, wwoods,
matthewkkk, douchebagger, steve and unluminous
unbeauty among others….....
Christalmighty, how many monikers you got ?
You said it right, Margaret!
Will he be able to come back and post again, under “Jack Barnes” or any of his other multiples… now that the webmaster has changed the requirements for posting, ie you have to sign on properly? Less opportunity for hundreds of multiples. Sysadmin might have banned “Jack” for that already… he sounded upset about something like that in one of his e-mails to me.
I wonder if we have seen the last of “Jack”??
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