The Teamsters Could Be Fearless Again

Maximilian Alvarez: Welcome, everyone, to Working People, a podcast about the lives, jobs, dreams and struggles of the working class today. Working People is a proud member of the Labor Radio Podcast Network and is brought to you in partnership with In These Times Magazine and The Real News Network. This show is produced by Jules Taylor and made possible by the support of listeners like you.

One of the questions that you have overwhelmingly told us that you want to see addressed on the show is the question that we are dedicating today’s episode to. Now that we are one year into the second Trump administration, what the hell is going on with the Teamsters and the union’s general president, Sean O’Brien?

I’m going to read at length from a really thought-provoking article by Hank Kennedy, which was just published in Current Affairs magazine. Kennedy writes: ​“Elected as a union militant, with the support of longstanding reform organization Teamsters for a Democratic Union (TDU), [Sean] O’Brien has spent the last two years shepherding the lambs of the American working class straight to the slaughter via his endorsements and promotions of some of the most reactionary, anti-labor politicians in the land.

“I was complicit in this. Back in 2021, I was a Teamster working in logistics. I both voted and campaigned for O’Brien, giving money and time to his campaign.

“2024 erased whatever residual affection I’d had for O’Brien. That year he not only spoke of Donald Trump as a man ​‘proven to be one tough SOB’ at the Republican National Convention, he promoted as ​‘100% on point’ a transphobic article by Senator Josh Hawley.

“There has been a phenomenon within the union’s leadership of working towards Trump. Whatever Trump says, the union leadership leaps to support, often without looking. When Trump called for a 100% tariff on foreign films — a vague term given how many U.S. productions are filmed in Canada and elsewhere—Hollywood’s Teamsters went right along with it.

“Under O’Brien the Teamsters went on record supporting the president’s pick for Secretary of Labor, Laurie Chavez DeRemer, and O’Brien himself wrote an op-ed calling her ​“The Pro-Worker Choice for Labor” in Compact [Magazine]. Under questioning, DeRemer admitted that she no longer supported the section of the PRO Act weakening state anti-union right-to-work laws.

“In his podcast guests, statements, and endorsements, O’Brien has established a deliberate pattern of behavior. Therefore, when the Teamsters trumpeted their endorsement of incumbent Republican [Gov.] Greg Abbott in this year’s Texas gubernatorial election, it should not have been a surprise, although the reaction was swift and negative. The Teamster leadership’s embrace of far-right politicians like Hawley, Abbott, and [Vivek] Ramaswamy is not a glitch, a fluke, or an accident, but part of a broad political strategy to curry favor with some of the most anti-labor politicians in the country.”

Kennedy continues. ​“What has been gained by O’Brien’s podcast pugilism and right-wing flattery?” Kennedy asks. ​“Not the PRO Act, which remains mired in Congress and is still opposed by Trump and Vice President J.D. Vance. Not a repeal of right-to-work laws which Abbott continues to support after his long career railing against ​‘Big Labor.’ Not federal help organizing Amazon, which refuses to sign a union contract with Amazon Teamsters in New York.

Instead, Trump has appointed a former UPS and Amazon safety compliance officer to head [the Occupational Safety and Health Administration] OSHA, despite both companies’ poor safety records. Union-busting lawyer Crystal Carey was nominated to serve as chief counsel for the National Labor Relations Board. Federal employees have seen their unions decertified under flimsy justifications of ​‘national security.’ ICE has even showed up to Teamster picket lines to intimidate strikers. Even the seemingly historic UPS contract is coming apart amidst dozens of hub closings and tens of thousands of layoffs.”

To help us make sense of this, I am really grateful to be joined on the show today by two guests, both of whom are running for office as part of the Fearless slate in the 2026 Teamsters elections, which are going to take place later this year in November. Our first guest is Richard Hooker Jr., who has dedicated 26 years to the Teamsters, spending 20 of those years at UPS and the last six in leadership roles. He is the secretary treasurer and principal officer of Teamsters Local 623, in Philadelphia, and he is now running to unseat O’Brien as a candidate for general president of the Teamsters union.

We are also joined today by John Palmer. John has 38 years of experience in the Teamsters, and he is currently serving as a vice president at large of the International Brotherhood of Teamsters. John is also running as a candidate to be the union’s general secretary treasurer.

Thank you both so much for joining me today. I want to start by giving you each a chance to respond directly to our audience’s big question.

Richard Hooker Jr.: Max, thank you for having us on this show. We really appreciate it.

I don’t know what his thinking was. If you remember back when he first ran, he criticized [James] Hoffa for doing the exact same thing he’s doing now. So you have to ask yourself, what makes a person say one thing and then do something totally different? It was all about getting elected. Whatever he needs to say to get elected, he’s willing to do that. But look at what Trump has done to labor. He comes into office and he strips the TSA workers of their contract. Then he turns around and does it to another million federal workers. Weakens the NLRB, no quorum. He’s telling you what and who he is, but O’Brien knew this already. He said it when he first ran. He talked about Trump like the anti-labor person that he is, but then when he gets into office, he goes and takes a picture with him.

I wish I had an answer to that question about why he did it, but I think it’s just self-service: whatever I can get, whatever I can do for myself — not the rest of the members, not the 1.3 million members that you swore to uphold and protect. He didn’t do that. 

And now look at us. Our members are getting shot dead in the street. We’re losing. The members are losing because of his decision. What are we going to do about it? That’s the question that I think people have really got to start asking themselves. What are we going to do about this decision that has put not just the Teamsters in harm’s way, but all of the working class in harm’s way? 

Alvarez: And John, you and I spoke right after O’Brien’s RNC speech, leading up to the 2024 election, and you were one of the only very vocal critics in Teamsters leadership of what O’Brien was doing and saying. I’m wondering now if you feel vindicated, and if that feels like a really bittersweet pill at this point. 

John Palmer: You make a good point. I’m really not looking to be vindicated. I want my union to act like it’s working on behalf of working people, and not just the working people that the 1.25 million members that are paying dues to the Teamsters right now, but the broader labor movement.

I took a stance on several things about Trump, and Trump, Abbott, Ramaswamy, on every measure, they fail labor massively – even on those broader measures where we’re talking about morality.

Look, I don’t know how in the world the commander in chief can be a draft-dodger. That offends me to the highest degree, as having been in the Army, served in the Army. And my father did. My uncles did. We all served. We served proudly. I volunteered to go into the army. The other sort of moral turpitude that’s flying around, right now, the whole Epstein files thing.

This is broader than just us as a labor movement. I think there’s where we’re falling short right now. We have been in this sort of corporate union mentality, where we run ourselves like a business, and we’ve overlooked — we’ve separated ourselves from our brothers and sisters at the AFL-CIO. We could argue that maybe they need some help reforming as well, and I wouldn’t deny that, but we need to be with our brothers and sisters in this. This is an epic battle, and this isn’t about the unions. This is bigger than the unions.

But we can’t do it if we think we’re Teamsters versus everybody. And trying to curry favor with politicians that are serial liars and can’t be trusted. We’re not going to affiliate ourselves with politicians and work our way out of this jam.

Hooker Jr.: If anybody wants to find out more about our slate, you can go to our website be​-fear​less​.org. That’s be​-fear​less​.org. If you want to donate, make sure you are Teamster because we can’t accept any donations unless you are a Teamster. No employer donations. We do need donations, and we need your support. There’s a lot of traveling that we are going to be doing, and we want to get to as many people as we possibly can. The main thing is, talk to your co workers, your brothers and sisters, let them know that there is a better option of leadership, and they will have a chance to put that on the ballot this summer and later on this fall. It’s your right. It’s your responsibility to vote. It’s your responsibility to have leadership that looks like you, that wants the best for you, and that is you because this Fearless slate is you, and we need you. Please visit us. The website, be​-fear​less​.org. Talk to your coworkers, and we look forward to seeing you real, real soon.

Alvarez: I want to thank our guests, Richard Hooker Jr. and John Palmer, veteran members and leaders from the International Brotherhood of Teamsters, who are both running for office in this year’s union elections as part of the Fearless slate. Thank you all for listening and for caring. We’ll see y’all back here next time for another episode of Working People. In the meantime, go explore all the great work that we’re doing at The Real News Network, across our YouTube channel, our different podcast feeds, our website and our social media pages. I’m Maximilian Alvarez. Take care of yourselves. Take care of each other. Solidarity forever.

This episode of the Working People Podcast was originally published on March 4.